Industries Are Us! Discuss them here..

[slider38]

Well, I have good news and bad news. The good news - everything works as advertised. The bad news - that means that onadeathwish, your problem lies elsewhere. I reloaded the port and annex files and added the visitors good to my Goods.xml. I setup the port industry as an out-of-city industry. I setup the industry to receive grain (it was handy) and export visitors. After running the track to the port, I had no problem adding the annex.

visitors_building.jpg

Here you can see the visitors building up after having delivered grain to the port.
I grabbed a set of passenger cars to use as a visitors train car.

visitor_cars.jpg

These are visitor cars loading and heading out.
I decided to switch the output to mail. I wanted to see if any animation occurred.

output_mail.jpg

Sure enough when mail was picked up, the mailbag swung on its hook and momentarily disappeared. And one of the bags on the annex deck disappeared as the hook was reloaded. However, this is a totally false impression. Mail is created solely as a result of grain being delivered. What happens on the annex deck is nothing but a result of the USDepot animation files. It doesn't actually mean there is actually mail to be picked up. Whether anyone would ever use the port for mail, I don't know.
I went back and restarted the game to see how double tracks would be handled. It works as a normal annex. The annex jumps back as another track is added. There is no overpass.

No_overpass.jpg

There was also no movement of people on the platform at all during any testing.

As to your problem onadeathwish, you need to follow Snoopy's instructions and post copies of your xml files. The problem probably lies there.

[snoopy55]

Once we get the problem OnaDeathWish has worked out, I'll look into redoing that Annex. I think that as it is for a Port, no single Good needs to have loading animation, so I think doing it as a NIF would work fine. Rebuilding the Port itself may be a challenge, tho it may not be worth it to mess with it. We'll see, thoughts of how it's done, and I've done things like this before, are seeping into my brain..... I hope there is room up there.......

[OnaDeathWish]

Well, let's try this - Zip and upload your Goods XML and your Industries XML and we'll take a look at them. Industries both the crash and the working versions.

One thing I will suggest to you, when you create a map and are using BB, create a single folder, say warehouse and place the BBs into it still in their folders. This makes it easier to verify them and to remove them if you want. When you get the map working, then you can pull the files out of their folders.

This is bugging me too........

Slider - who built this Port and Annex? It contains 21 KFs just for mail! Try putting the Port and Annex on that map you are working on and see what you come up with. If I can grab some time I'll try it on my Picture Studio map.

Ok here's the two zips of the goods and industries xml's. I have them labeled non working & working. I still cannot even get the depot to appear without a CTD, I even went ahead and made a test map and was able to put it on the map without a CTD, but as soon as I try and add a depot it CTD on the test map as well. It also still CTD when I had the output as visitors, I have none as the input, not sure if that matters at all or not.

I did have everything in a folder labeled assets, but you telling me to put the bb_items folders in the warehouse folder makes more sense, I didn't know that would work. I now have it labeled warehouse and only the two folders in it one of them is BB_visitors and the other is BB_Passenger_Port. I will not be adding anything else until I get this one working, why create more problems, just focus on one for now.

http://www.filedropper.com/pointofimpact-nonworking
http://www.filedropper.com/pointofimpact-working

[slider38]

Well I downloaded your files from this website (I really don't like doing that). All I got when I tried to unzip them was a bunch of errors. Invalid files. Unrepairable errors. It would be better if you just zip them yourself and attach them to your post. Anyway, I couldn't get them open.

One thing you might look at - I know it sounds simple, but errors can come from anywhere. Make sure that the name of the good you are using in the industry resource matches the name in your goods.xml. While the icons are listed as icon_visitor, the name of the good in the goods.xml that came with the bb is Visitors. Were you to put Visitor in your industry rather than Visitors (plural) you will get a crash to desktop, which is what you are getting. As to your inability to get the depot to place on the map, that's a stumper, as I had no problem getting it to show up on my practice map. When you zip your xmls, please include your depots.xml. Perhaps there is something there. Is your map a SAM or are you using globals? I have never built anything but SAMs, but I know Snoopy has knowledge on how maps built on globals are supposed to be structured. We would really like to get you going. If you do not have 7-zip, you might want to grab that. It is a simple program that does a great job of file compression and is easy to use. There is probably a link in the Wiki. It's free.

Snoopy, once we get ona going on this there is a lot that can be done to clean up this industry. As it is it's a mess. Some of this can be cleaned up with a little help from Blender. Also, I have to believe that a number of these diff files can be combined. It's just a matter of moving things around and then working through the changes on the uv map. I'll bet the size of this thing can be cut almost in half.

[snoopy55]

Slider, attached are the files. And I agree, we'll have to clean up this Port! I asked Bobby where it came from and got this answer: Silly boy Terry made it and used the building by you. I just did the colors on the dds files. Then you made the BB out of it.

OnaDeathWish - like Slider asked, upload your Depots XML for us. Or even the whole map as you have it. We can work out the problem for you. The upload can be deleted later, which we usually do when a finished map or updated map comes out. Heck, it could be your Scenario XMl also!

To upload zipped files here look below this box you are typing in and there is a blue line labeled Settings. Just below that is Options and Upload Attachments. The last is what you use to post zips and pics here. Just click on the words.

[OnaDeathWish]

OnaDeathWish - like Slider asked, upload your Depots XML for us. Or even the whole map as you have it. We can work out the problem for you. The upload can be deleted later, which we usually do when a finished map or updated map comes out. Heck, it could be your Scenario XMl also!

To upload zipped files here look below this box you are typing in and there is a blue line labeled Settings. Just below that is Options and Upload Attachments. The last is what you use to post zips and pics here. Just click on the words.

Thanks snoopy55, I was trying to figure out how to add the files on here, I wasn't sure if you guys used a third party website or not. I didn't even notice that portion of the upload at the bottom of the forum post. I already have a zip program (both winrar and zip program that came with windows 10) installed it may have been the site that messed up the files, and I apologize for having you have to go through there.

Here's all the files for the current map, this includes the warehouse folder, and the two bb's in there as well and all the xml's.

Well I downloaded your files from this website (I really don't like doing that). All I got when I tried to unzip them was a bunch of errors. Invalid files. Unrepairable errors. It would be better if you just zip them yourself and attach them to your post. Anyway, I couldn't get them open.

One thing you might look at - I know it sounds simple, but errors can come from anywhere. Make sure that the name of the good you are using in the industry resource matches the name in your goods.xml. While the icons are listed as icon_visitor, the name of the good in the goods.xml that came with the bb is Visitors. Were you to put Visitor in your industry rather than Visitors (plural) you will get a crash to desktop, which is what you are getting.

Yea i did check to make sure the names were named the same in the goods.xml and the industries.xml, that was one of the first things I checked. What's weird is that it won't even let me put out a depot even if I have named as passengers.

As to your inability to get the depot to place on the map, that's a stumper, as I had no problem getting it to show up on my practice map. When you zip your xmls, please include your depots.xml. Perhaps there is something there. Is your map a SAM or are you using globals? I have never built anything but SAMs, but I know Snoopy has knowledge on how maps built on globals are supposed to be structured. We would really like to get you going. If you do not have 7-zip, you might want to grab that. It is a simple program that does a great job of file compression and is easy to use. There is probably a link in the Wiki. It's free.

Well I was going to use a combination of both, some custom stuff and some original stuff. I wasn't going to be creating anything new myself to put in there as I am not that advanced on how to make that all work, I was just going to use other peoples makings and add into my own, and maybe change the names of some stuff here and there or not change them at all. Right now I don't have anything in the scenario xml, other than the default from what the editor gave me when I first got done creating the terrain on the map, I only tried adding the bb_passenger_port and the bb_visitors.

Thaks guys.

[snoopy55]

Well, I hate to be the one to say it, but this map cannot run with any Goods Mods that are used in the map.

I took out Visitors and put in Rice, with Rice shipping from the Port. Crash. I used Rice as both input and Output. Crash. I used Passengers as the Output. Loaded fine. But, when I checked the list of Goods, NO RICE! I even took the RRT_Goods.xml from the New Hampshire map, along with the Warehouse folder and added it. Crash! I've been at this for nine years, torn everything in this game apart and seen people try almost everything possible with this game, but I've never had a problem like this!

The only possible thing I can think of is the heights you use in this map. Back when this game came out most people had 1 or 2 gig of memory. The map Mesa Madness could not be run by most people. We figured it was the height of the Mesas that did it. When members accrued more memory, the map could be run. I'm running a Quad Core with 8 Gig of memory, the 3 Gig enabler set and 12 Gig of Virtual Memory and your map will not work with Goods Mods.

I did figure out why you could not place a Depot at the Port - when you added the Port Annex and renamed the Depots XML, you forgot to change the name in the Scenario. Common error, even for advanced mappers.

Now, back to the Goods. The attached map had Canned Beer in the Goods. It will run, but if you check the Goods list ion the map, no Canned Beer appears. I next did a full listing of Food in RRT_Goods_test.xml. The map ran. I created RRT_Goods_test_2.xml and edited the Scenario XML to use it. I deleted the Canned Beer and changed the name of Food to Good Food. The map ran, but Good Food did not show. I set the Coal Mine to receive Good Food. (BTW, I had removed the Port when I started these tests) The map started fine, until I looked at the Coal Mine. It crashed as the production listings at the Coal Mine were supposed to show.

So, you can add all the Goods Mods you want, you just cannot use them. Industry and Depot mods will work as long as you use Original Goods for them.

You might try lowering the ground level to half what you have it and try it.

But then I just tried another test. I took the New Hampshire map and edited the Scenario to use the Midwest15 map. It ran fine. I tried the same thing with your map and it started fine, but crashed when I went to the Coal Mine which is set to load Good Food. And Good Food and Canned Beer are not on the maps Goods listing. This puts it at the games Map Maker........ BTW, are you using the latest version of the game, Sid Meier's Railroads! Patch 1.10? If not it is available here: downloads.php?cat=3 Also, have you gone thru the Tutorials? viewforum.php?f=62 There is a lot of useful stuff in there.

I've attached the work I did, except for the map change, I won't confuse you with that, I've most likely confused you enough already.

I'm going to close here as I have to restart my system....... this map played with something..... No, don't worry about it, it ain't the first to do it and it won't be the last!!

[slider38]

Well, I can't figure out what this map is doing. I can not get it to recognize the existence of the visitors good. For that matter, once I started trying a few different approaches, I couldn't get it to run at all. I assume this map uses globals and I guess I just don't understand the architecture. I removed every good except pass, mail and visitors and still couldn't get it to start. I tried to use a goods.xml rather than the one that was map specific and that didn't work either. Beyond that, I don't know what to do with it. A good bashing is probably what it needs.

On a side note, you have a call in the scenario to RRT_Difficulty.xml.

<DecorationsXMLFile>RRT_Decorations_Point of Impact.xml</DecorationsXMLFile>
<DepotsXMLFile>RRT_Depots_Point of Impact.xml</DepotsXMLFile>
<DepotsXMLFile>RRT_Difficulty.xml</DepotsXMLFile> <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
<EraXMLFile>RRT_Eras_Default.xml</EraXMLFile>

If you want this in your scenario it should be <DifficultyXMLFile>RRT_Difficulty.xml</DifficultySMLFile>
This however, is unrelated to the other problems. I commented it out and still got the same crashes.

[snoopy55]

Hmmmmm, I saw the Difficulty XML reference, but never looked and the opening and closing of it.

If that was to me, thanks. If not, thanks anyway.

[OnaDeathWish]

Well, I hate to be the one to say it, but this map cannot run with any Goods Mods that are used in the map.

I took out Visitors and put in Rice, with Rice shipping from the Port. Crash. I used Rice as both input and Output. Crash. I used Passengers as the Output. Loaded fine. But, when I checked the list of Goods, NO RICE! I even took the RRT_Goods.xml from the New Hampshire map, along with the Warehouse folder and added it. Crash! I've been at this for nine years, torn everything in this game apart and seen people try almost everything possible with this game, but I've never had a problem like this!

The only possible thing I can think of is the heights you use in this map. Back when this game came out most people had 1 or 2 gig of memory. The map Mesa Madness could not be run by most people. We figured it was the height of the Mesas that did it. When members accrued more memory, the map could be run. I'm running a Quad Core with 8 Gig of memory, the 3 Gig enabler set and 12 Gig of Virtual Memory and your map will not work with Goods Mods.

I did figure out why you could not place a Depot at the Port - when you added the Port Annex and renamed the Depots XML, you forgot to change the name in the Scenario. Common error, even for advanced mappers.

Now, back to the Goods. The attached map had Canned Beer in the Goods. It will run, but if you check the Goods list ion the map, no Canned Beer appears. I next did a full listing of Food in RRT_Goods_test.xml. The map ran. I created RRT_Goods_test_2.xml and edited the Scenario XML to use it. I deleted the Canned Beer and changed the name of Food to Good Food. The map ran, but Good Food did not show. I set the Coal Mine to receive Good Food. (BTW, I had removed the Port when I started these tests) The map started fine, until I looked at the Coal Mine. It crashed as the production listings at the Coal Mine were supposed to show.

So, you can add all the Goods Mods you want, you just cannot use them. Industry and Depot mods will work as long as you use Original Goods for them.

You might try lowering the ground level to half what you have it and try it.

But then I just tried another test. I took the New Hampshire map and edited the Scenario to use the Midwest15 map. It ran fine. I tried the same thing with your map and it started fine, but crashed when I went to the Coal Mine which is set to load Good Food. And Good Food and Canned Beer are not on the maps Goods listing. This puts it at the games Map Maker........ BTW, are you using the latest version of the game, Sid Meier's Railroads! Patch 1.10? If not it is available here: downloads.php?cat=3 Also, have you gone thru the Tutorials? viewforum.php?f=62 There is a lot of useful stuff in there.

I've attached the work I did, except for the map change, I won't confuse you with that, I've most likely confused you enough already.

I'm going to close here as I have to restart my system....... this map played with something..... No, don't worry about it, it ain't the first to do it and it won't be the last!!

Well thanks for trying and getting it to work, I guess the experts get stumped once in awhile.

I have tried adding the bb_passenger_port to a test map using the US_East scenario and i got it to load fine and add a depot to it, so i think you may be right that it has something to do with the terrain height, maybe the depot needs to be near or at the same height as the port itself, i will experiment with that more and see what happens.

As for my system i also have a quad processor (2.4ghz) and 4gb RAM, and i do have the game updated to the current version (1.1.0.0) so i know that has nothing to do with it. As i have downlaoded and played several other user made maps and played them fine. But i know you need to ask, just to cover all your bases.

I have gone through the tutorials, but there isn't one for adding BB_ Items, there is one for adding BB_Trains, but nothing for items like this one i'm trying to add, unless it is in a different location in the tutorials and i just missed it.

I also noticed the difficulty in the scenario and fixed that as well.

Thanks for looking into this for me guys.

[OnaDeathWish]

Well I altered the terrain as you had suggested snoopy55 and I was able to put out the passenger port and also was able to actually add a depot to it without a CTD. :D I guess the depot has to be near the same level as the actual port. well now I know not have it the way I had it before.

Now the next hurdle to figure out is the use of the visitors. I would have really liked to use that port, but I guess i will have to try and find something else that will allow me to use them instead.

Thanks for all your help and suggestions guys.

[snoopy55]

The Depot can be placed, it's when you add a Mod Good BB that you end up using that it crashes.

As to adding BBs to a map, I got the Trains one posted and got interrupted on other things and no one asked for more info to remind me.

For a Good, you copy everything from <Good> to </Good> and paste it in the Goods XML between </Good> and </RRTGoods> at the bottom. Be sure to get it ABOVE the </RRTGoods>

For an Industry you copy everything between <RRTIndustry> and </RRTIndustry> and paste it in the Industries XML between <RRTIndustry> and </Industries> at the bottom.

For a TrainCar you copy everything between <TrainCar> and </TrainCar> and paste it in the TrainCars XML between </TrainCar> and </RRTGoodCars> . You'll find this at the lower quarter above the Tender Cars.

The only other thing you have to do is include the folder that comes with the BB in your Warehouse folder. You added the Port and the Depot, you're doing it right, we just have to get that map of your to accept them!

Just for the heck of it, you might try a simple map, land and water, and try adding the same things to it. Not copy the XMLs and add them to the map, but creating it from scratch. There is something very loony about this map..........

[OnaDeathWish]

Ok snoopy55.

No problem on the adding BB tutorial, I figured it all out.

Now every time I load the map and start playing and testing it, I get a CTD after about 5 minutes or so. I'm going to recreate the whole terrain again and see if that fixes the problem, last time I just lowered the terrain on the original one I made, instead of starting from scratch again. The only thing I haven't done is remove the things I added and see if that fixes the problem and maybe I can pinpoint the cause that way. I'll keep you posted on what happens. Thanks for all your help.

[snoopy55]

Alright, just a quick one here. A 5 minute crash sounds like it may be the Events XML. The attached Events XMl is stripped for just the Globals. If the game calls for an Event and you are not using the Good, it will crash.

Mind you, you can rename this for your map if you wish to, but it is really not needed, just make sure the name of the XML matches the name in your Scenario XML for the Events XML. Later you can add the full listing for the Events for the Goods you have to this XML.

[OnaDeathWish]

Thanks, Snoopy.

That is the one thing i was thinking it could be, because everything else is fine, and i removed some stuff from one, but didn't know that if i had one in there that was not in the goods list it would CTD. I'll just use the one above you suggested until i'm ready to add the others.

[snoopy55]

When you add the ones for your map, don't be afraid to create your own Headlines and Subhead. There have even been a few custom Images for Events done. Slider worked up a Tutorial on it which can be found on the second page of Tutorials & How To - viewforum.php?f=43 I have a Tutorial on that page you may want to look at - Routing and Event Creation

[slider38]

I have added The industry - Coal Port to the "Industries Are Us"folder. I had intended to use this in my current map and have tested it as a receiver of coal and it worked fine. However, testing for playability led me to ultimately remove it. Still, it's an interesting facility, able to load ships quickly and efficiently. Several were built. This one was modeled after the Newport News coal port constructed by the C & O Railroad in 1881. I had thought about putting a coal ship in place, but after getting this far, I could not afford to add more vertices to the nif.

coal_pier-3.jpg

I have also used a coal car without wheels as the annex for this industry. That is included in the "Industries Are Us" posting.

[rodea2007]

I have added The industry - Coal Port to the "Industries Are Us"folder. I had intended to use this in my current map and have tested it as a receiver of coal and it worked fine. However, testing for playability led me to ultimately remove it. Still, it's an interesting facility, able to load ships quickly and efficiently. Several were built. This one was modeled after the Newport News coal port constructed by the C & O Railroad in 1881. I had thought about putting a coal ship in place, but after getting this far, I could not afford to add more vertices to the nif.

coal_pier-3.jpg

I have also used a coal car without wheels as the annex for this industry. That is included in the "Industries Are Us" posting.

Upload that mod, maybe I can help you to make what you mean

[slider38]

Rodea, the industry is posted in "Industries are Us" thread. I'm not unhappy with it at all. I just found that for reasons of playability, I probably will not end up using it in the map I am currently working on. But I will probably use it in some future map.

[slider38]

I have posted a Cotton Plantation industry I will use on the map currently underway.

BB_Cotton_Plantation.jpg

I just wanted to thank Snoopy for the posting of his Cotton Farm - I used his plants. And whoever posted the old Courthouse industry - that one goes back a long time. I took it and added some chimneys and made a few other minor adjustments. Thanks to all that post to these forums.